Alternatives to vancian system spells.

Forum for the discussion of proposals people would like to make.
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Inox
Knight of the Realm
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Re: Alternatives to vancian system spells.

Post by Inox » 2012-03-08

I think we need to look closely at what makes things overpowering in the game dynamic.

For example, I don't think anyone could ever cast Detect Traps* or Comprehend Languages enough that they could become a balance issue. They just don't have any ability whatsoever to influence combat.

On the other hand, how many protection cloaks, Heals/Res, Fireballs, and Warp Woods can be thrown into the mix definitely has a profound effect.

Ultimately, the biggest balance issue is always how much can be done AT ONCE. For the purposes of our game, we can probably balance it a lot like 4th Edition D&D, in that our most important context is the "Encounter", or single battle/engagement.

What someone can do 15 minutes later doesn't matter except in protracted fortification battles. What matters is what they do ASAP, that minute. Anything more than 5 minutes out is probably way after the fact in most conflicts.

Just some food for thought.




* - In fact, Detect Traps is a crappy, crappy spell that probably needs an upgrade due to the way we do dungeons & traps in modern Darkon. It's not even worth the SP now, because it doesn't give you any info about what the trap is, or how to deal with it. Plus, you can't sustain it; it works just at that second, in a 10' burst. Lame.
Prince Inox Elsonáge Thensiur
Swordslinger of No Quarter!
Warriors' Guild, OE, CCx8, CM(Warrior Mage)
Beast of BABALON

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Sir Tyriel Firebrand
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Re: Alternatives to vancian system spells.

Post by Sir Tyriel Firebrand » 2012-03-08

The other thing is that there could be more that the game does as a culture to help that type of stuff out too. Instead of just being like this:

Thief: "I detect traps"
DM: "You see the trap."

You could make it an active spell that helps the thief know where it is, and once they find it, it will help them know how to disarm it. The use of physical props goes a long way. I've heard stories of the game being that way, why are we not that way anymore?
~No Quarter!~
~Warriors Guild~
~Knight of Tuesday~
~"Winning is teaching, losing is learning"~

BaiterofBAMC
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Re: Alternatives to vancian system spells.

Post by BaiterofBAMC » 2012-03-09

Tyrial, BAMC had a campout where there was some map that had random buried treasure. As typical, the first random Darkonians that found it started to " roleplay" " I start digging" The elder did nothing. The first group walks off. The second group finding the map goes to the area saw that there was a shovel and actually started to dig in the dirt. Needless to say, the second group found the real buried treasure. I'm pretty sure there's some players that talk about how they actually dug up some buried treasure at a campout.

During the Eldorado campout enthusiastic players actually chipped away some gold painted rocks they we were using as " gold" and was able to score points for doing that.

It's about the elders giving a crap and making it a worthwhile experience for the player. As an elder, making the player work for the skill makes the encounter memorable. The timed traps that some countries set up with a buzzer was great and got people in to the adventures.


That being said. I think that Inox has a good point in that we need to look at spells in a different light.

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Sir Tyriel Firebrand
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Re: Alternatives to vancian system spells.

Post by Sir Tyriel Firebrand » 2012-03-09

I agree. I have been working on a lot of stuff myself lately, that I'm hoping will help to submerge myself and others into a Rp mood. I'm big on the physical representation of things. I think its a culture thing though, make people actually interact with things instead of a live table top kind of thing.
~No Quarter!~
~Warriors Guild~
~Knight of Tuesday~
~"Winning is teaching, losing is learning"~

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